Back in lockdown again.

[4liters]

Ummm....people are using animal grade versions of the drug is the problem and seems to be a key point you've missed. The concentration in the animal version is substantially higher given the size and weight of cows and horses is significantly larger than your average human.

Ivermectin (human version) has a significantly longer history of usage and safety data then coronavirus gene therapy vaccinations.

Sounds like they didn't do their own research instead of just jamming a tube of horse paste down their throat.

Or maybe they did. The dosage needed to fry a test tube full of covid was dangerously high compared to what is used to treat lice and bumworms so perhaps they're using the near lethal quantities identified in that study.

There are plenty of drugs that are usable cross-species and it's not common sense to everyone to think beyond that despite it's being the same drug that the concentration of the core components will be based on the size of the species it's being produced for.

OK, but surely if you're taking some sort of drug in a form not designed for humans you'd do a bit of your own research on it first to make sure you're taking an effective dose.

[ducky]

Ummm....people are using animal grade versions of the drug is the problem and seems to be a key point you've missed. The concentration in the animal version is substantially higher given the size and weight of cows and horses is significantly larger than your average human.

Ivermectin (human version) has a significantly longer history of usage and safety data then coronavirus gene therapy vaccinations.

Sounds like they didn't do their own research instead of just jamming a tube of horse paste down their throat.

Or maybe they did. The dosage needed to fry a test tube full of covid was dangerously high compared to what is used to treat lice and bumworms so perhaps they're using the near lethal quantities identified in that study.

There are plenty of drugs that are usable cross-species and it's not common sense to everyone to think beyond that despite it's being the same drug that the concentration of the core components will be based on the size of the species it's being produced for.

OK, but surely if you're taking some sort of drug in a form not designed for humans you'd do a bit of your own research on it first to make sure you're taking an effective dose.

Why would these high level mooks concern themselves with what they are putting in their body? Ohhh… wait.

[happyfriggincamper]

Ummm....people are using animal grade versions of the drug is the problem and seems to be a key point you've missed. The concentration in the animal version is substantially higher given the size and weight of cows and horses is significantly larger than your average human.

Ivermectin (human version) has a significantly longer history of usage and safety data then coronavirus gene therapy vaccinations.

Sounds like they didn't do their own research instead of just jamming a tube of horse paste down their throat.

Or maybe they did. The dosage needed to fry a test tube full of covid was dangerously high compared to what is used to treat lice and bumworms so perhaps they're using the near lethal quantities identified in that study.

There are plenty of drugs that are usable cross-species and it's not common sense to everyone to think beyond that despite it's being the same drug that the concentration of the core components will be based on the size of the species it's being produced for.

OK, but surely if you're taking some sort of drug in a form not designed for humans you'd do a bit of your own research on it first to make sure you're taking an effective dose.

Sorry I don't know the discussion you are trying to drive cos how I read it is that yes I agree for this example that it's common sense to check and also there is the reality also (for all things) that some people don't bother to research into things they do and just go by a streamlined logic or blind trust and this approach can end badly in some circumstances.

[happyfriggincamper]

Ummm....people are using animal grade versions of the drug is the problem and seems to be a key point you've missed. The concentration in the animal version is substantially higher given the size and weight of cows and horses is significantly larger than your average human.

Ivermectin (human version) has a significantly longer history of usage and safety data then coronavirus gene therapy vaccinations.

There are non mRNA vaccine options available ie the traditional proven for many decades type of vaccine if the mRNA types are of concern to you.

The vector based ones? I could be wrong but my understanding is they still stem from the original generation of gene-based vaccine therapy research which started in the late 80's and utilise the artificial spike protein which has been the main point of concern stopping these types of medications making to market prior to the Covid EUA approvals. If its the vector based ones you are talking about - what are the other vector based vaccines that have been in market for decades?

There's some protein based ones, the Novavax vaccine we'll start getting here is one of these. Although if you're worried about the involvement of gene technology you're probably out of luck as pretty much all of them use some sort of modified protein.

That said, there's an all-natural source of the spike protein coming everyone's way in a few months for anyone not keen on the artificial one. The side effects aren't nice though, and it has an approximately 1% fatality rate.

What's this new product that's coming?

I know it wasn't your statement (frozen pods), but do you know what other vaccines he was referring to that use the same immune response approach as the non-mRna vaccine (again presuming he was speaking to the vector based ones)?

[DougieK]

What's this new product that's coming?

This is the best thing ever.

[frozenpod]

Ummm....people are using animal grade versions of the drug is the problem and seems to be a key point you've missed. The concentration in the animal version is substantially higher given the size and weight of cows and horses is significantly larger than your average human.

Ivermectin (human version) has a significantly longer history of usage and safety data then coronavirus gene therapy vaccinations.

There are non mRNA vaccine options available ie the traditional proven for many decades type of vaccine if the mRNA types are of concern to you.

The vector based ones? I could be wrong but my understanding is they still stem from the original generation of gene-based vaccine therapy research which started in the late 80's and utilise the artificial spike protein which has been the main point of concern stopping these types of medications making to market prior to the Covid EUA approvals. If its the vector based ones you are talking about - what are the other vector based vaccines that have been in market for decades?

Astrazeneca vaccine, Johnson and Johnson vaccine are non replicating vector vaccine.
This technology was first used in the 1970's.

Novavaxx vaccine which is expected to be soon available is a subunit protein vaccine and the technology was first used in the 1980's.

[4liters]

Ummm....people are using animal grade versions of the drug is the problem and seems to be a key point you've missed. The concentration in the animal version is substantially higher given the size and weight of cows and horses is significantly larger than your average human.

Ivermectin (human version) has a significantly longer history of usage and safety data then coronavirus gene therapy vaccinations.

There are non mRNA vaccine options available ie the traditional proven for many decades type of vaccine if the mRNA types are of concern to you.

The vector based ones? I could be wrong but my understanding is they still stem from the original generation of gene-based vaccine therapy research which started in the late 80's and utilise the artificial spike protein which has been the main point of concern stopping these types of medications making to market prior to the Covid EUA approvals. If its the vector based ones you are talking about - what are the other vector based vaccines that have been in market for decades?

There's some protein based ones, the Novavax vaccine we'll start getting here is one of these. Although if you're worried about the involvement of gene technology you're probably out of luck as pretty much all of them use some sort of modified protein.

That said, there's an all-natural source of the spike protein coming everyone's way in a few months for anyone not keen on the artificial one. The side effects aren't nice though, and it has an approximately 1% fatality rate.

What's this new product that's coming?

I know it wasn't your statement (frozen pods), but do you know what other vaccines he was referring to that use the same immune response approach as the non-mRna vaccine (again presuming he was speaking to the vector based ones)?

He's probably referring to the adenovirus vector vaccines, they've got a virus (it's from the family of viruses that cause the common cold) and get it to express the spike protein from covid. There's a few ways of doing this but it generally involves a bit of gene editing though so you might not want it. The AstraZenica, Sputnik V, J&J are all this type of vaccine.

There's also some inactive virus vaccines, essentially they just kill a bunch of covid vaccines and inject you with the remains. The various bits of protein trigger an immune response. Again, I think they use a modified covid virus for this. SinoVac is this type of vaccine, there aren't any of these on the list to be bought into Australia though.

The reason they use a lot of genetic engineering is the spike protein doesn't stay in the right shape without some other proteins holding it together. There was an Australian vaccine candidate that used a second protein from HIV to hold the spike protein together, unfortunately it caused false positives for HIV due to the extra protein so it was stopped early in it's development. The other solution it to replace some of the amino acids in the spike protein with different ones that cause it to fold more naturally without any additional proteins. Ultimately your immune system recognises the shape and positioning of the active site of the protein so the exact amino acid sequence doesn't need to be the same as the wild type virus.

mRNA vaccines are the ultimate (currently at least) form of that. They trick your cells into producing the spike protein with some of the amino acids replaced so it folds into the correct shape. It's basically doing the same thing a virus does - introduce DNA, RNA, mRNA (different viruses do it slightly differently) into a cell and hijack the cell's machinery to make proteins. The difference is that this just makes a single protein rather than the components of an entire virus that can then go and invade more cells and make you really sick. Because mRNA is just a temporary 'messenger' molecule that carries information between the DNA in the cell's nucleus and the protein making machinery outside the nucleus it doesn't make any permanent changes other than the immune response it provokes.

[Carlito]

I could have a guess that the conspiracy theories around covid vaccines are mostly to blame.

There is a theory that big pharma and Bill Gates have engineered the vaccine to kill people.

No there is zero credible evidence to support this claim but some people for reason I just don't get seem to believe this and will try anything else but the tried, tested and proven vaccine.

I got my 2nd Jab about 6 weeks ago...when does the death side effect kick in?

It's fine mate, you only get a mild case of death, (more a heavy case of existential dread really).

[Mattblack]

I could have a guess that the conspiracy theories around covid vaccines are mostly to blame.

There is a theory that big pharma and Bill Gates have engineered the vaccine to kill people.

No there is zero credible evidence to support this claim but some people for reason I just don't get seem to believe this and will try anything else but the tried, tested and proven vaccine.

I got my 2nd Jab about 6 weeks ago...when does the death side effect kick in?

It's fine mate, you only get a mild case of death, (more a heavy case of existential dread really).

Oh well....sounds better than home schooling

[4liters]

They are much too rash and reckless, tempting God and disregarding everything which might counteract death and the plague. They distain the use of medicines; they do not avoid places and persons infected by the plague, but lightheartedly make sport of it and wish to prove how independent they are. They say that it is God’s punishment; if he wants to protect them he can do so without medicines or our carefulness. This is not trusting God but tempting him. God has created medicines and provided us with intelligence to guard and take good care of the body so that we can live in good health.

If one makes no use of intelligence or medicine when he could do so without detriment to his neighbor, such a person injures his body and must beware lest he become a suicide in God’s eyes. By the same reasoning a person might forego eating and drinking, clothing and shelter, and boldly proclaim his faith that if God wanted to preserve him from starvation and cold, he could do so without food and clothing. Actually that would be suicide.

It is even more shameful for a person to pay no heed to his own body and to fail to protect it against the plague the best he is able, and then to infect and poison others who might have remained alive if he had taken care of his body as he should have. He is thus responsible before God for his neighbor’s death and is a murderer many times over.

That was Martin Luther in the 1500s. The more things change the more they stay the same.