Stalking and spinning

rb85
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Re: Stalking and spinning

Post by rb85 » Mon Dec 02, 2019 8:53 am

skronkman wrote:
Mon Dec 02, 2019 5:54 am
rb85 wrote:
Sun Dec 01, 2019 9:01 pm
That’s just strange what did he yell.
“Oi! This is private property and you’re trespassing.” Something along those lines and then a brief description of his legal ownership of the river between 2 fence lines.
Seems like a hangover of aristocratic land rights. Unfortunately the law is probably on his side. As long as no rubbish is left behind or livestock hassled I cannot see the issue.
Another one bites the dust.

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meppstas
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Re: Stalking and spinning

Post by meppstas » Mon Dec 02, 2019 11:16 am

rb85 wrote:
Mon Dec 02, 2019 8:53 am
skronkman wrote:
Mon Dec 02, 2019 5:54 am
rb85 wrote:
Sun Dec 01, 2019 9:01 pm
That’s just strange what did he yell.
“Oi! This is private property and you’re trespassing.” Something along those lines and then a brief description of his legal ownership of the river between 2 fence lines.
Seems like a hangover of aristocratic land rights. Unfortunately the law is probably on his side. As long as no rubbish is left behind or livestock hassled I cannot see the issue.
Thing is Seb, he may have had problems with others at one stage and has had enough of it.. it happens down here quite a lot where the odd fisho doesn't care, they think a trout license gives them the right to walk/enter any property that has a river/stream running through it, a fishing license doesn't give anyone the right to do so... That's why I always approach the landowner to gain permission to fish a water that runs trough property, even when it has the trespasses prosecuted on it, I also give them a card with my photo, name & contact number on it once I've gained their permission. I've only been knocked back once by a land owner many years ago & it was because one person he allowed to enter his property tried to sue him after he tripped over a loose fence wire that had been knocked down by cattle.. So I can see why they get a little irate when someone walks through their property. It took me 2-1/2 years to gain permission from a farmer to enter his property due to several other factors (fences down, gates left open etc) done by other fisho's, thankfully in the end I was given the okay to fish the stream that runs trough 3-1/2kms of the property on the proviso I do not take anyone with me.. I was quite happy to agree to that, nothing better than having a trout stream to myself.. :sr: There's a lot of idiots out there that ruin it for others and it's something that will probably never change which is a shame.. I still feel if skonkman approaches the land owner he has nothing to lose, he may even get the nod to go fishing there..

cheers
Adrian
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skronkman
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Re: Stalking and spinning

Post by skronkman » Mon Dec 02, 2019 4:26 pm

To my knowledge he was correct. He owned land on both sides of the river and his title gave him riparian ownership. I didn’t know where I was, I entered the river on public land and waded down for a kilometre or so. When I came up onto the bank and started heading back to my car (as it’s easier than wading up stream) I was on the bank of the river in a paddock. I discussed it with some locals afterwards and apparently it’s a thing in some places but not others and all has to do with zoning and historical ownerships and permissions. One landowner might have rights to the river and the next one might not.

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meppstas
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Re: Stalking and spinning

Post by meppstas » Mon Dec 02, 2019 4:56 pm

skronkman wrote:
Mon Dec 02, 2019 4:26 pm
To my knowledge he was correct. He owned land on both sides of the river and his title gave him riparian ownership. I didn’t know where I was, I entered the river on public land and waded down for a kilometre or so. When I came up onto the bank and started heading back to my car (as it’s easier than wading up stream) I was on the bank of the river in a paddock. I discussed it with some locals afterwards and apparently it’s a thing in some places but not others and all has to do with zoning and historical ownerships and permissions. One landowner might have rights to the river and the next one might not.
That's spot on and that's how it is down here as well.. I've done the same thing, get in a river and fish my way upstream for a kilomtre & more only to find I'm on private land when I hopped out the river to walk back to the car.. :oo: :oo:

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Adrian
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Re: Stalking and spinning

Post by rb85 » Mon Dec 02, 2019 6:48 pm

meppstas wrote:
Mon Dec 02, 2019 4:56 pm
skronkman wrote:
Mon Dec 02, 2019 4:26 pm
To my knowledge he was correct. He owned land on both sides of the river and his title gave him riparian ownership. I didn’t know where I was, I entered the river on public land and waded down for a kilometre or so. When I came up onto the bank and started heading back to my car (as it’s easier than wading up stream) I was on the bank of the river in a paddock. I discussed it with some locals afterwards and apparently it’s a thing in some places but not others and all has to do with zoning and historical ownerships and permissions. One landowner might have rights to the river and the next one might not.
That's spot on and that's how it is down here as well.. I've done the same thing, get in a river and fish my way upstream for a kilomtre & more only to find I'm on private land when I hopped out the river to walk back to the car.. :oo: :oo:

cheers
Adrian
It's ridiculous these ancient aristocratic ownership of streams should be stopped in today's day and age. Should be remade to crown land.
Another one bites the dust.

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Re: Stalking and spinning

Post by trout-hunter » Tue Dec 17, 2019 6:29 am

Sounds like one of my weekends, these rivers do cop a flogging, its almost like the evolution of fish is taking a turn, they hardly aggressively attack as much as i remember, to me they tend to chase and bump more often and 1 in 5 or so would actually get lipped but spit the lure like the hook isn't setting.. maby i should stop removing the barbs from my hooks though.. i even remove all treble hooks from my lures and place 1 hook on the tail end, less chance of snags, less tangles in the net and also less chance of hooking a fish haha.. oh well

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Re: Stalking and spinning

Post by skronkman » Tue Dec 17, 2019 8:07 am

trout-hunter wrote:
Tue Dec 17, 2019 6:29 am
Sounds like one of my weekends, these rivers do cop a flogging, its almost like the evolution of fish is taking a turn, they hardly aggressively attack as much as i remember, to me they tend to chase and bump more often and 1 in 5 or so would actually get lipped but spit the lure like the hook isn't setting.. maby i should stop removing the barbs from my hooks though.. i even remove all treble hooks from my lures and place 1 hook on the tail end, less chance of snags, less tangles in the net and also less chance of hooking a fish haha.. oh well
I too prefer to change over my trebles to singles but found the hookup rate on trout dropped to nearly zero, so I don’t do it now on small lures for trout. Still do it on all my salt fishing lures though. Many trout hooked are not actually in the mouth but around the gills or under the fins. Without trebles I doubt I would have hooked them at all. I lose enough fish even with barbs intact so I don’t press them down, with good needle nose pliers most times I can unhook without much damage. The odd one that swallows the whole thing can be a bit difficult.

I don’t think the trout are evolving (just my opinion as I’m not an evolutionary biologist) but it seems to be time of day or seasonal. They are sometimes aggressive or hungry, other times just curious or lazy. As I am a lazy fisherman and usually fishing gentleman hours I think I’m missing the hot bite times. Beer gets in the way around dusk (another reason I find prawning difficult!) and I’m not an early riser for dawn (beer probably has something to do with that too.)

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Re: Stalking and spinning

Post by Aimless » Tue Dec 17, 2019 2:42 pm

Sounds like a great getaway. I'd like to something similar over January when I have some time off.

How do you find access points? Scout them out on Google Maps before hand or just drive around and keep your eyes open? Cheers

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Re: Stalking and spinning

Post by skronkman » Wed Dec 18, 2019 9:28 am

I’m lucky enough to have family members that own some river frontage on the little Stevenson. So I start there. But yeah, google maps to find river that crosses roads, park your car and get in the river. I prefer old hiking boots and shorts to waders. Then start stalking the river up or down stream. The further you go from the road the more remote it gets. Just prepare yourself for the long walk back to the car, fishing can while away many hours without even second seeming to pass, walking upstream back to the car for 2km can seem to take bloody Yonkers.

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Re: Stalking and spinning

Post by Davo » Sat Jun 13, 2020 11:33 pm

The little Steavenson is wholly owned bed and bank, top to bottom - there is no public access bar the top 10 m which is in the reserve of the main river. All access is by permission of the owner only. It doesn’t matter if you start at a public access point, you need to have access permission throughout. If you start in private property with permission you can’t go out of that property into another property (without permission ).There was an owner at the split with the main river who gave access in years gone by, but unfortunately he sold up and the new owner does not give access. The owner of the lower section above the highway does not give access either.

People think there’s a ‘Queens Chain’, access right - but that is a myth in Victoria.There is either a crown reserve (Or other public land, defined by survey points, or there is not). For instance there is no reserve and so no public access In the main Steavenson (without private owner permission) for about 400 m from the Maroondah going upstream. Lots of people trespass up there not knowing that they are! There are sections of the Acheron, Rubicon, Goulburn (nearly all of the breakaway section) and many other rivers where there is no crown reserve, or at least none on one of the banks. If a farmer yells you off, he may well be in the right! Mind you I once got threatened off on the King Parrot but later found access would have been legal.

You can think what you like about whether that’s as it should be, but it is what it is. A lot of private owners have had fences cut, stock lost, guns discharged, rubbish left, public liability claim for injury etc. One owner I know in that area allowed some guys access through his private land and they left a huge pile of rubbish. Next time they just drove onto his land without asking. When they disappeared into the river the owner let down all their tyres! And fair enough.

Private owners denying access not just through paddocks but also along banks is something that happened a lot in NSW where a lot of titles included bed and bank, but a change to the fisheries management act 1994 (change was 10 or so years ago?) overrides that, so if you stay within the high water mark (not flood level, it’s normal high water mark) AND enter From a public access point, you are now legal. NSW not vic!

VFA is apparently working to make legal access ways to public river reserves (unused road reserves through paddocks etc) that exist but are not obvious more known (Signage etc) , but there are apparently no plans to copy the NSW model. So in any areas of private ownership with no crown reserve or other public land means you would be trespassing without permission, and this won’t change.

Skronkman if your relative owns about 600 m of the middle of the Little, with a first name starting with P, I know him. I am pretty sure (if that’s your relo) that he leases the flat between the rivers now to people who own below, who won’t give access (maybe they are the ones that kicked you off?) Unless you are in the plantation section above or the similar short block above that? Or the red house up near the split where access used to be given but no longer is?

You can find Crown reserves - and lack of them, on Mapshare website...

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